Canada’s housing crisis is off the charts, and half the country lives paycheck to paycheck. In a classic show of disconnect, some Trudeau Liberals think the party's greatest problem is that people don’t understand how fabulous a job they’re actually doing.
We have that. It is called FPTP. It forgoes being a party system entirely and sees that leaders hire an individual they want to have represent them. Each representative meets with the leaders in their home riding, gathers a general consensus from the town square, and then carries that consensus to Ottawa (or respective provincial capital) where it is combined with every other riding doing the same. The outcome is that the will of the majority is realized.
That may be what we need, but it is not what we want. The reality is that being the leader sucks and meeting in the town square regularly is hard work. People just want to vote for (or maybe not even that much) who they think is the best dictator and let the the dictator do his thing – perhaps with some checks and balances to make sure the dictatorial power doesn’t go completely to his head. We’ve tried to hack that onto FPTP over the years, but it was never designed for that mode of use, and as you would expect the results are dismal. Indeed, we do need a new system if we want to not have to express our will.
That’s just nonsense. You don’t seem to have any connection to reality.
Stephen Harper ran up the deficit and the debt, destroyed years of scientific research, muzzled government experts who didn’t agree with his christofascist dogma, and had the support of 36.3%, 37.7%, and 39.6% of the popular vote. At no point did he have the support of the majority of Canadians.
Our current Liberal + NDP government with 50.44% of the popular vote is the closes things we’ve had in a very long time to a government that represents the will of the majority of Canadians.
More fantastic nonsense.
What happens if New Brunswick of Alberta manage to elect a couple of christfascists and those people hold the balance of power. What if they demand that PP take away women’s rights and the rights of the LGBTQ Canadians? 56% of Canadians agree that women should have the right to choose and that percentage is growing. 85% support LGBTQ rights. Why should a few extremists be allowed to force the government to go against the will of the majority of the people as a result of a quirk of our electoral system?
The NDP national dental care plan which they forced the Liberals to implement actually has the support of 72% of Canadians. In that case a party that truly cares for the well being of the people is forcing a useless, old school party to follow the will of the people. As I said, this is the most democratic government we’ve had in a long time.
Look, I know your way is to spew fantastic nonsense that has no connection to reality. If you want to have a conversation based in reality we can. I’m not going to argue with your fantasies.
We went over this:
“The reality is that being the leader sucks and meeting in the town square regularly is hard work. People just want to vote for (or maybe not even that much) who they think is the best dictator and let the the dictator do his thing […] We’ve tried to hack that onto FPTP over the years, but it was never designed for that mode of use, and as you would expect the results are dismal. Indeed, we do need a new system if we want to not have to express our will.”
Was there something in that which was not clear?
Honestly, I am unsure of what this is trying to say. My best interpretation is that it is still trying to point out that our bastardized attempt to turn FPTP into something it is not has failed, but that would just be repeating the quote quoted above it, so clearly I have missed the mark.
What you’re saying is a strange, fantasy that has no connection to reality.
Sorry…I’m not interested in talking about your fantasies. We really need to discuss the reality of the Canadian political situation.
Have a good day.
Well, no. The context of discussion centres around an earlier commenter’s claim that “We need a system that truly reflects the will on the majority of Canadians.” That cannot discuss the reality of the Canadian political situation as it is fundamentally forward looking to a reality which does not yet exist. FPTP, used as it was designed, is very well suited to achieving what is stated.
But it does mean that the people have to express their will, and they have proven that they don’t want to. They prefer to spend time focusing on their job, their family, friends, writing internet comments, etc. And fair enough. They want to hand control to a higher power and get back to their individual lives. FPTP is not at all suited to that.
No, it isn’t, as I said above. The Harper government was elected three times with less than 40% of the popular vote and did all the things that Conservatives do, ran up the deficit, ran up the debt, cut taxes for the rich and corporations, cut services for everyone else, burned decades of scientific research and muzzled government experts to push his christofascist dogmatic agenda, passed unconstitutional laws as a dog whistle to his christofascist base then spent millions of dollars defending them to the Supreme Court only to have 100% of those unconstutitional laws struck down. How is that representing the majority of Canadians when then had the support of less than 40%?
The current Liberal + NDP agreement government far better represents the will of the people but it’s a quirk of the FPTP system.
Yeah, no. The fact that you can actually name the dictator tells that this is not FPTP as it was designed. That is how it has come to be used, because people don’t want to express their will, but that has already been talked about to death.
Again, the FPTP system was designed to have the people select one representative who gathers locally to talk about their concerns and objectives with the local people. The representative then takes the result of that to Ottawa to combine with all of the other localities that have done the same to reach an ultimate consensus. The representative’s actions in Ottawa are recorded to make sure he has honoured what took place locally.
That is not how we use it. It has been bastardized to the point that it makes no sense. But we could if wanted to have the will of the majority represented. There is nothing stopping us other than doing the democratic work a democracy expects. The only possibly better way to have the will represented is to have us all travel to Ottawa and all gather together. That doesn’t scale so well, though, and it’s a long way from Vancouver.
To be fair, it’s also quirky that you have been able to determine the will of the people as they don’t usually want to express their will. Typically they’d rather let someone else figure it out. Hence how we got here.
You see? This is the kind of nonsense that is disconnected from reality. Harper was freely and fairly elected and was defeated in a free and fair election. He was nothing approaching a dictator.
I’m simply not willing to continue to discuss this with you if you’re not making arguments that are connected to reality.
Have a good day.
The only time Harper was not elected in a Canadian federal election was the first one he participated in. He resigned from politics about six months after his last election win. Maybe you are trying to imply that the resignation was a defeat? But that did not happen during the election.
Are you, maybe, talking about an election other than the Canadian federal election?
It sure seemed like you were trying to say that he had total control over the country at one time. I do not disagree. If that is not the case, why did you bring him up?